'97 E300D "Check Electronic Engine Control" and Horrible Idle
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 2
'97 E300D "Check Electronic Engine Control" and Horrible Idle
Hi All,
New poster here. I've perused the forum and found help before, but I'm either "search challenged," or this hasn't been covered in a while. Please forgive me if it has and point me to the posts.
Our '97 E300D has been running fine since I pulled the intake manifold off and cleaned out all of the carbon crust from the resonance flaps, intake runners, etc. about 10,000 miles ago. It was doing the "normal" surge that has been discussed on this forum before. Just less than 100K on the car at this point.
My wife (normal driver of the car) said "gee, the check engine light is on." I went to start it this morning, let the glo plug light go out, then fired it up. It started running, but was making an "abnormal" knocking, the glo plug light came back on, lots of smoke, and generally running rough. It was running on about 4 or 5 cylinders, and hence I think why the unusual knocking, smoke, etc.
The dash "info center" said "check electronic engine control."
So, I started it several times, and it acted the same each time.
Questions:
-What does the "check electronic engine control" mean (beyond the obvious of check it)? How does one go about checking the electronic engine control? Is there a "reasonably priced" code reader that can be used to download info?
-Has anyone found a decent repair manual for these things? I haven't been able to purchase from our local dealer (Bellevue, Washington Barrier Motors). I have found CD-ROM manuals, supposedly "factory manuals," on e-bay. They generally go for around $20 or $30 for the CD set. I am thinking of taking a chance on it to see if it's any good. It's got to be better than what I currently have (nothing).
Any insight y'all have would be appreciated!
Thanks
Gale
New poster here. I've perused the forum and found help before, but I'm either "search challenged," or this hasn't been covered in a while. Please forgive me if it has and point me to the posts.
Our '97 E300D has been running fine since I pulled the intake manifold off and cleaned out all of the carbon crust from the resonance flaps, intake runners, etc. about 10,000 miles ago. It was doing the "normal" surge that has been discussed on this forum before. Just less than 100K on the car at this point.
My wife (normal driver of the car) said "gee, the check engine light is on." I went to start it this morning, let the glo plug light go out, then fired it up. It started running, but was making an "abnormal" knocking, the glo plug light came back on, lots of smoke, and generally running rough. It was running on about 4 or 5 cylinders, and hence I think why the unusual knocking, smoke, etc.
The dash "info center" said "check electronic engine control."
So, I started it several times, and it acted the same each time.
Questions:
-What does the "check electronic engine control" mean (beyond the obvious of check it)? How does one go about checking the electronic engine control? Is there a "reasonably priced" code reader that can be used to download info?
-Has anyone found a decent repair manual for these things? I haven't been able to purchase from our local dealer (Bellevue, Washington Barrier Motors). I have found CD-ROM manuals, supposedly "factory manuals," on e-bay. They generally go for around $20 or $30 for the CD set. I am thinking of taking a chance on it to see if it's any good. It's got to be better than what I currently have (nothing).
Any insight y'all have would be appreciated!
Thanks
Gale
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 2
RE: '97 E300D "Check Electronic Engine Control" and Horrible Idle
Yes, answers. None easy (as I've grown accustom to on this car), but answers none-the-less.
The "check electronic engine control" basically means “check engine†light in a “normal†OBD-II sense. I purchased a regular ODB-II code reader and was able to pull the codes. I can’t remember what they were at this point, but it was able to clear them. Because the condition was not resolved, the “check electronic engine control†light came back on.
Bear in mind that the rest of the systems on the car (everything NOT with the engine control, stuff like climate control, etc.) are run off of another set protocols and not associated with the OBD-II specs. These are Mercedes-specific codes on the Mercedes-specific computer that require the Mercedes-specific code reader. And, unlike OBD-II codes, those codes will NOT reset themselves after the error condition has been resolved. A code reader must be used to clear them. (Cheapest reader that I found when I had an A/C issue at the time was $1500 or so.) But, I digress.
Repair manual. I went with an e-bay purchase for the WIS (Workshop Information System, if I remember right) DVD set from MB for ‘all Mercedes vehicles from when the earth was just cooling until now’ type of deal.
If you have not had the pleasure of wandering through the WIS install and subsequent usage, sit down and get ready to truly enjoy the wonders of modern software… Yes, I am indeed kidding. It was one of the more frustrating parts of the process.
The OBD-II codes are indeed in WIS, if you can pinpoint/wade through/locate/otherwise sleuth them out. I did eventually find them, and if I remember right, the code pointed to “ignition system.†Wow, thanks for the help.
As I was working through all of this, it also struck me that the glo plug light coming back on may indeed be at issue. I proceeded to take them out and test them (I simply plugged them back into their glo plug wire, grounded the body of the glo plug to the frame, then turned the key on. Working ones get hot immediately. Non-working ones don’t.). Two of my 6 glo plugs would not get hot. I changed them out, and the problem went away.
I suspect that I had one cool or cold glo plug, and the car was able to function with 5 working ones. Then, when the 2nd one went, it was enough to cause the rough idle, poor running, and tripping the “check electronic engine control†light. But, that’s just a guess.
Hope this helps!
Gale
None easy (as I've grown accustom to on this car), but answers none-the-less.The "check electronic engine control" basically means “check engine†light in a “normal†OBD-II sense. I purchased a regular ODB-II code reader and was able to pull the codes. I can’t remember what they were at this point, but it was able to clear them. Because the condition was not resolved, the “check electronic engine control†light came back on.
Bear in mind that the rest of the systems on the car (everything NOT with the engine control, stuff like climate control, etc.) are run off of another set protocols and not associated with the OBD-II specs. These are Mercedes-specific codes on the Mercedes-specific computer that require the Mercedes-specific code reader. And, unlike OBD-II codes, those codes will NOT reset themselves after the error condition has been resolved. A code reader must be used to clear them. (Cheapest reader that I found when I had an A/C issue at the time was $1500 or so.) But, I digress.
Repair manual. I went with an e-bay purchase for the WIS (Workshop Information System, if I remember right) DVD set from MB for ‘all Mercedes vehicles from when the earth was just cooling until now’ type of deal.
If you have not had the pleasure of wandering through the WIS install and subsequent usage, sit down and get ready to truly enjoy the wonders of modern software… Yes, I am indeed kidding. It was one of the more frustrating parts of the process.
The OBD-II codes are indeed in WIS, if you can pinpoint/wade through/locate/otherwise sleuth them out. I did eventually find them, and if I remember right, the code pointed to “ignition system.†Wow, thanks for the help.
As I was working through all of this, it also struck me that the glo plug light coming back on may indeed be at issue. I proceeded to take them out and test them (I simply plugged them back into their glo plug wire, grounded the body of the glo plug to the frame, then turned the key on. Working ones get hot immediately. Non-working ones don’t.). Two of my 6 glo plugs would not get hot. I changed them out, and the problem went away.
I suspect that I had one cool or cold glo plug, and the car was able to function with 5 working ones. Then, when the 2nd one went, it was enough to cause the rough idle, poor running, and tripping the “check electronic engine control†light. But, that’s just a guess.
Hope this helps!
Gale
Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 68
RE: '97 E300D "Check Electronic Engine Control" and Horrible Idle
I read your post, and thanks for the information regarding the glow plug issue. Regarding the wis dvd, I too got one off ebay that was sent from the U.K., and you are right, it was a pain to get the software installed. The search feature could be a lot better, but it is usable once you get to the right section. Good luck with your car.......
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4
From: North of San Francisco
I'm looking for OBD2 experience on Diesels...
I'm new to this WebSite/FORUM but not so new to Diesel MB(s) and now recently have picked up a somewhat capable OBD2 "Scanner"... NOT just an "Reader". In addition to the manual/reading material that cam with my scanner, I have purchased the Haynes OBD2 manual which is very good for learning the basics. Now I'm hoping to find or help start a FORUM on Mercedes OBD2 with THREADs on this same subject.
Although I consider myself to be a "newbie" with both MB(s) and OBD2, IMHO there is potential for us DIYers to purchase and use these tools [ scanners ] to great advantage.
I have started with the "Actron CP-9145" [in a Kit that is the CP-9150] that sold for about $170. I had researched scanners on Consumer Reports and browsed a bit using Google and then decided on this model. IF you are looking to do something along this line, I would recommend a scanner that must be a newer generation that allows you to download the EPROM's "firmware"/software and upgrade the scanner so it will be able to more fully deal with new model year cars as they roll off the assembly line!
P.S. - Working with an MB INDY mechanic friend, we came up with a way to do timing checks on the older 4 & 5 cylinder "in-line" diesel engines using a timing light together with a "Kent-Moore" meter designed specifical for use as we are doing. I feel this is within + or minus 2 degrees accuracy with is plenty good for these bullet proof engines. We have tested a lot of these engines and typically find them off [ retarded ] from 4 to 6 degrees... or advanced at around 18 to 24 degrees (spec). We can now check one of these engine's timing in ~5 minutes. The Kent-Moore meter was an Ebay purchase for ~$200. New they sold for ~$1,000 originally. There are other products out there new for about $200 and we tried one that we had to send back to the manufacturer! We will add a 5mm sensor to our 6mm clamp/sensor so we can hook up to the smaller fuel lines. These use a piezo-electric pulse sensor clamps that are precise for the size of line. So my INDY fried now offers to test diesel engine timing for only $50 with one FREE retest!
Out of here...
Regards,
Sam Ross
Although I consider myself to be a "newbie" with both MB(s) and OBD2, IMHO there is potential for us DIYers to purchase and use these tools [ scanners ] to great advantage.
I have started with the "Actron CP-9145" [in a Kit that is the CP-9150] that sold for about $170. I had researched scanners on Consumer Reports and browsed a bit using Google and then decided on this model. IF you are looking to do something along this line, I would recommend a scanner that must be a newer generation that allows you to download the EPROM's "firmware"/software and upgrade the scanner so it will be able to more fully deal with new model year cars as they roll off the assembly line!
P.S. - Working with an MB INDY mechanic friend, we came up with a way to do timing checks on the older 4 & 5 cylinder "in-line" diesel engines using a timing light together with a "Kent-Moore" meter designed specifical for use as we are doing. I feel this is within + or minus 2 degrees accuracy with is plenty good for these bullet proof engines. We have tested a lot of these engines and typically find them off [ retarded ] from 4 to 6 degrees... or advanced at around 18 to 24 degrees (spec). We can now check one of these engine's timing in ~5 minutes. The Kent-Moore meter was an Ebay purchase for ~$200. New they sold for ~$1,000 originally. There are other products out there new for about $200 and we tried one that we had to send back to the manufacturer! We will add a 5mm sensor to our 6mm clamp/sensor so we can hook up to the smaller fuel lines. These use a piezo-electric pulse sensor clamps that are precise for the size of line. So my INDY fried now offers to test diesel engine timing for only $50 with one FREE retest!
Out of here...
Regards,
Sam Ross
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