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C220 W202 Instrument Cluster fault
Living in Oz, my car is right hand drive C220 Elegance W202 chassis gasoline auto with 111 series engine.
The instrument cluster is misbehaving in a similar way to others but I don't believe I have read a definite solution to my issue. When I turn the key to the last position before start, all the diagnostics light come on as usual, but quite often, none of the gauge needles (fuel, temp, oil) register. Then I start the engine, all diagnostics lights go out as normal, the engine fires OK but the Revs does not display any movement. I can then drive off and still no needles work - but the trip meter and the klms traveled work just fine. No speed, no fuel gauge, or temp working. When I stop and park the car, switch off engine, all seems normal and no instrument lights issues at shut down. Often, I can then restart the car right away and find all needles working as they should. What has been done to date with a mechanic. 1. Tech tools diagnostics plugged in and found these errors - * - Code 049 (mixture too rich etc). * - Code B1748 (connection to ETS control module is short circuit to positive terminal. Another message on the screen but with no error code said "Instrument Cluster, fuel gauge sensor open circuit". 2. Removed the Instrument cluster from the dash - found no lose connections including earth connections all fine - has part numbers VDO 110.008.736/002 and MB Part No 2025406047 on a white label on the cluster. 3. Have run the engine with the instrument cluster pulled out of the dash with needles not registering and moved the whole cluster around by hand - no changes to fault. 4. OVP relay has been tested including trying one from another identical vehicle - no change. 5. With engine running, have checked the ignition key area for possible faults - all seems fine. 6. We did observe when we turn the key on, and the needles do not respond, the fuel gauge needle actually drops down slightly below the 0 indicator on the fuel gauge and constantly flickers slightly. When we turn the ignition key off, that fuel gauge needle returns to a position just slightly above the 0 as is its normal position. There is no consistent pattern to this one. very strange - Hope someone can recommend a solution. Indications of a failed instrument cluster the likely problem? As replacement part is cost-prohibitive, and if recommendations from this forum indicate an instrument cluster overhaul, would appreciate who is best to repair or exchange by cluster. If an exchange, can anyone confirm the instrument cluster is the same for left or right hand drive please or would I be best advised to have mine overhauled? There are no repair facilities for this issue in Oz. Can anyone advise if the info at this website regards circuits is correct please? Google Translate Hope someone can help. Roadhugger 1995 C220 Elegance (when its going good) 2002 C200K Kompressor - ladies car 1989 300SE - W126 - my favorite ================= |
Originally Posted by Roadhugger
(Post 159753)
Living in Oz, my car is right hand drive C220 Elegance W202 chassis gasoline auto with 111 series engine.
The instrument cluster is misbehaving in a similar way to others but I don't believe I have read a definite solution to my issue. When I turn the key to the last position before start, all the diagnostics light come on as usual, but quite often, none of the gauge needles (fuel, temp, oil) register. Then I start the engine, all diagnostics lights go out as normal, the engine fires OK but the Revs does not display any movement. I can then drive off and still no needles work - but the trip meter and the klms traveled work just fine. No speed, no fuel gauge, or temp working. When I stop and park the car, switch off engine, all seems normal and no instrument lights issues at shut down. Often, I can then restart the car right away and find all needles working as they should. What has been done to date with a mechanic. 1. Tech tools diagnostics plugged in and found these errors - * - Code 049 (mixture too rich etc). * - Code B1748 (connection to ETS control module is short circuit to positive terminal. Another message on the screen but with no error code said "Instrument Cluster, fuel gauge sensor open circuit". 2. Removed the Instrument cluster from the dash - found no lose connections including earth connections all fine - has part numbers VDO 110.008.736/002 and MB Part No 2025406047 on a white label on the cluster. 3. Have run the engine with the instrument cluster pulled out of the dash with needles not registering and moved the whole cluster around by hand - no changes to fault. 4. OVP relay has been tested including trying one from another identical vehicle - no change. 5. With engine running, have checked the ignition key area for possible faults - all seems fine. 6. We did observe when we turn the key on, and the needles do not respond, the fuel gauge needle actually drops down slightly below the 0 indicator on the fuel gauge and constantly flickers slightly. When we turn the ignition key off, that fuel gauge needle returns to a position just slightly above the 0 as is its normal position. There is no consistent pattern to this one. very strange - Hope someone can recommend a solution. Indications of a failed instrument cluster the likely problem? As replacement part is cost-prohibitive, and if recommendations from this forum indicate an instrument cluster overhaul, would appreciate who is best to repair or exchange by cluster. If an exchange, can anyone confirm the instrument cluster is the same for left or right hand drive please or would I be best advised to have mine overhauled? There are no repair facilities for this issue in Oz. Can anyone advise if the info at this website regards circuits is correct please? Google Translate Hope someone can help. Roadhugger 1995 C220 Elegance (when its going good) 2002 C200K Kompressor - ladies car 1989 300SE - W126 - my favorite ================= Found in the right side trunk behind the paneling at the right side along the fender at the wheel well area, a wire harness was shorting out on the fender/support.It just wore threw the tape and rubbed a small hole in the harness, and was shorting out. blowing the cluster fuse. good luck. |
W202 C220 Instrument Cluster
Many thanks for the feedback.
The fuse which protects the cluster needles also powers the roadside red hazard dash switch which works fine. I plan to remove all the relavent fuses snd the cluster and clean all contacts with a spray. The needles (fuel, temp, revs and speed when you start driving) are the only thing effected. They either work at engine startup or they don't. All diagnostic lights operate as they should and go out soon after the engine fires. All lights around the car at all times work just fine in all circumstances even dash lights etc. When needles are operating, they have never stopped working while driving. Even had the Instrument panel out of the dash when the needles are working and while my friend was driving, shook the panel and twisted it around with the cables plugged in, tried severe braking and no failure. Yet on one occassion, we stopped, parked, turned the engine off and removed the key, then reinserted the key to start up again and no needles. Then went for a drive with the needles not operating and went through the same shake and twist process with no change. When we parked the car this time and switched off and then restarted again, the needles did not work again. This is a tough one. Have been in touch with BBA-reman.com/UK and they believe can repair mine - approx US$350 plus shipping is the killer - another US$300!! The MB part no is 2025406047 which contains KPH speedo. Roadhugger ========================
Originally Posted by chassis221
(Post 159756)
I did have a situation in a 202 chassis with the fuse for the instrument cluster would sometimes blow, it wouldnt always blow a fuse, but at times the cluster gauges would not work just as you said. sometimes they would be fine and have no problems. problem seemed to accur when turning corners mostly. I think in my situation the rear tail lights were also affected.
Found in the right side trunk behind the paneling at the right side along the fender at the wheel well area, a wire harness was shorting out on the fender/support.It just wore threw the tape and rubbed a small hole in the harness, and was shorting out. blowing the cluster fuse. good luck. |
I am having a similar problem on my 94 C280 but my temp gauge still works just no gas, MPH or RPM....any suggestions?
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Ok I had the same problem. U need the remove the cluster and clean the needles they get stuck from parking in the sun. Hope this help
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Was this issue ever resolved ? I have a '95 C180 with a faulty cluster. The fuel guage always reads empty, even when full. Once in a blue moon it reads correctly. This version has no sticky needles or needle rests. The water temp guage will shoot up to 100 or 120 on startup...engine still cold which turns on tha aux fans. During the trip it sometimes settles down to the normal 80 degrees, fans go off....... then after awhile it may shoot up to 120 c and bring the fans on again. I have taken the cluster out, turned, prodded, banged it, tugged at the wiring behind, removed and replace the connectors etc etc in trying to find a loose connection or whatever. All those antics do not bring the guage down to zero when cold. I have been battling with this for years and am now starting to worry about the aux fan bearings. In this case the issue is not with an overheating engine. I am unemployed so this is a fix I have to attempt myself so any help or comments will really be appreciated. Thanks guys :)
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whooo hooo. Temp guage appears to be normal again...just a tad above 80. I pulled all the relays and fuses one by one, front and back, and used a wire brush on a Dremel to polish them up. I had previously removed each one, inspected them and reinserted them. I was very sceptical about the cleaning of the blades but obviously it works. Have just driven around town a couple of times with stops and starts and so far she is behaving....let's give it a few more days. Also didn't jump to 120 on start up as was the usual situation.
Still no life from the fuel guage though...but that's never worked since I had the car.....now and again it pops up to the correct position but that's about twice a year. Edit. Removed the cluster again to try find the fuel guage problem. Used a hair dryer to try warm up the parts to try find a dry joint or whatever. Now the temp. guage is playing up again :( :( I've disconnected the battery to see if anything resets itself but I'm not too hopeful. |
Bernard,
The instruments behaved very erratically from time to time. No pattern I did have the part repaired by an instrument technician in Oz. The faulty part on mine was an IC – Part No NEC D16430AGF IC - I don’t have a circuit diagram so I am not aware of where this IC is located on the main board - sorry. My technician will not provide the circuit. you may be able to locate a circuit diagram in your part of the world? I have since sold the C220 – about 2 years ago and I have not heard anything from the new owner so I assume all is good. |
Thanks for coming back Roadhugger :) I always suspected a voltage regulator but I didn't know they looked like that. The pins on that chip are tiny and I don't think I'll be able to do it myself.
For starters I don't know how to get access to the front side of the PCB which which has the dials on. I tried to remove the needles yesterday but they won't budge. The part itself looks cheap enough...buy them in lots of 100 :) It may even just be a dry joint. The last time it worked the car was in the sun and it was stinking hot...especially the dash. After cooling down the guage stopped working. My brother's in Melbourne ( Kevin Rother ) I'll post it to him and he can take it :) :) :) |
2 Attachment(s)
Making progress on the fuel guage. It now works !!! :) The pic below (white side ) has 11 parts soldered at the top. I just reflowed these with a 15 watt iron. One fell off while I was applying heat ( the left one ). I clamped it on with a plastic peg and solderd one end, removed the peg and did the other end. Fuel guage now works but I need to recalibrate it. It reads a bit more than what's in the tank because it jumped a few teeth last year while I was trying to remove the needle. Can anyone tell me how to "un-jump" the teeth or remove the needle ?
Attachment 4852 The green side shows the rear of the board, directly behind the pins we soldered on the front. I reflowed all those as well. Attachment 4853 Can anyone tell me which pins / parts are linked to the temperature sensor ? That guage is still floating like a butterfly and kicking in the aux. fans now and again. I don't want to reflow any more than I really have to. The one that came off nearly gave me a heart attack :) |
contact Process
Bernard,
I have been in touch with the technician (in Sydney) who repaired mine. Provided the part numbers match the ones in earlier threads, he believes he can repair - approx AU$300 shipped to an Australian address. If you want to proceed, I can provide repairer contactdetails off-line at a private email address.- subject to approval by the moderator of this site. Then you and your brother can deal direct. Please send copy of this email to the moderator for approval. |
Thanks Road hugger. Just curious, why do I have to send a copy of this to a mod ??
I don't think our exchange rate between South Africa and Australia will be economical...may be cheaper to try source a working 2nd hand unit here. :) When I get another chance I will reflow some more connections ...just looking for a smaller iron as I think 15 watts is a bit hot for that board. Flexing the board seems to have an effect on the temp. guage...just have to find out where the weak point is. Lovely to have the fuel guage working again :):) |
Temp & Fuel guage issue resolved.
Well, after "fixing" the issues previously, only to have them return after a few months. BUT .... we were on the right track.
I subsequently took the circuit board out of the housing and took it to an electronics chap in town. I asked him to reflow all those 11 pins AGAIN at the top left of the white board shown earlier. ( my soldering iron was not fine enough for a good job) It took him half an hour ... he looked at a few other things while it was open. Resolved ! Temp. & Fuel Guages now snap to their last positions when the key is turned. No more fluctuating up and down while driving. The cost R100..... $6. :D |
I have a 1994 C-280. I replaced the instrument panel after a number of months following the purchase. It's been two years since I bought the car.
But today almost all of the warning lights stayed on after I started the engine, and none of the gauges seemed to work--speedometer, tachometer, gas gauge...after a while, the only lights that stayed on were the Check Engine light (another matter), the oil light, the warning light for the gas cap, and the light that indicates the gas tank is empty--it's actually nearly full. What's more, the lights stay on after the engine is shut off. And that was maybe two hours ago I shut off the engine last. (The main panel light came on normally when I had the car's headlights and taillights on) |
Originally Posted by Doug Montgomery
(Post 175124)
I have a 1994 C-280. I replaced the instrument panel after a number of months following the purchase. It's been two years since I bought the car.
But today almost all of the warning lights stayed on after I started the engine, and none of the gauges seemed to work--speedometer, tachometer, gas gauge...after a while, the only lights that stayed on were the Check Engine light (another matter), the oil light, the warning light for the gas cap, and the light that indicates the gas tank is empty--it's actually nearly full. What's more, the lights stay on after the engine is shut off. And that was maybe two hours ago I shut off the engine last. (The main panel light came on normally when I had the car's headlights and taillights on) |
Roadhugger - Instruments intermittent
C220 W202 Elegance Sedan Australia
Go on the Internet and buy a strip of MICROSCRUB (the stuff telephone techs used to use to clean contacts in the olden days) Get some CRC CONTACT CLEANER and spray the two sets of plug contacts on the back of the instrument cluster. Then go up and down the lines of pins on both plugs giving them a good clean with the MICROSCRUB - backwards and forwards and any other direction you can think of! Sorts out stopped gauges. While you've got the instrument cluster out, get a pack of 3/8" square plastic tube (AUD7.90 Hobby Shop). Cut a short piece (3") and adjust all the globes so they are making correct contact. The angles are all different. Good luck, Tom. |
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